Leaking Bavaria 37 cruiser (2014)

[julieian996]

Further to my post of April this year, our leaking window saga continues.

As the main salon windows are bonded (glued) into place, it now seems that the bond has failed, mainly due to flexing of the hull when sailing.

Several fixes have been tried, all work when the boat is in the marina, but as soon as its sailed, the stresses and flex open up the sealant again.

Bavaria have seen fit to replace all our salon windows both sides, as the leaks are bad, and allow water into the main salon, into cupboards.

There does appear to be an issue with the new bonded windows, but not seeing any other threads here.

Again, it has been a real pain, waiting for parts, and a dry 3 days to complete the work.

Would love to hear from anyone else with the same or similar model (33 cruiser has same windows) with a leak they have had either fixed, or continuing.

[tiger79]

No problems (touch wood!) with my 2014 Cruiser 37.  Indeed, the boat seems fairly stiff, so I'm surprised yours is flexing enough to destroy the window seals.  Has the boat been grounded?  Is the inner floor grid structure still firmly attached?

Glued-on windows are commonplace, and providing the correct adhesive and preparation methods are used, they should be fine for many years.  After all, most cars have glued-in windscreens and backlights, and these are essentially structural elements which help to resist body flexing.

I hope you get it resolved soon.

[Mirror45184]

Had a similar issue with a Cruiser 40 launched in 2009. The procedure we received for the repair is pasted below. Good luck!
Fixing Leaks In Hull Port Windows

Cheers


A Hull Port window can leak in 3 places

1.   Between the glass and the rubber seal
2.   The frame and the hull
3.   In the joins of the window frame.

Sometimes it is not easy to tell by just spraying water on it. Sometimes it only leaks in sailing conditions so may be impossible to detect at anchorage.

Solution.

Remove plastic insert. It is attached with Velcro.
Undo bolts and remove window completely (you will require a person in the dinghy or on a wharf to assist or it could drop out)
You will find that the hatch was sealed with a foam tape.
When window is removed place on flat surface and fill with water to test if window is leaking between glass and rubber.
If it is and the yacht is still under warranty it is best to request replacement window. Photos will be required to prove leak and serial number of window.

If yacht is not under warranty and you do not wish to purchase new window you can attempt the following. Undo the screws and carefully pull apart the window being careful not to bend the joiners.
When removing rubber from glass, be careful not to stretch or kink rubber.
Coat rubber in lanolin grease or silicon grease and re-insert around glass but be careful not to pinch rubber when sliding frame back into place, ensuring a good snug fit.
Do up frame and then test with water by filling frame and rubber with water and see if it leaks through.

To fit back into the hull, completely remove all foam tape and clean completely. Run a bead of sikaflex/silicon or similar around hull where frame will be inserted.

Insert Window into hull and do up bolts a bit at a time crossing diagonally from bolt to bolt. Do not over tighten or you will squeeze out all the silicon.  Wait 24 hours and then hand tighten all bolts. (what you are trying to do is create a gasket and completely seal the window. There is always some flex in hull under sailing conditions and having sufficient sikaflex between the hull and the fame will allow flexing with out water ingress.
Replace plastic insert.

[Symphony]

What you are describing is a different type of window from the ones used in the latest boats, which are one piece plastic glued to the coachroof sides with opening hatches glued into them.

[canuck]

Hi there - wondering if you got the issue of your leaking windows resolved.  I have a two year old 37 Cruiser, and the front of my window on the side of the boat that gets the sun in the marina, has now parted ways, and the caulking is cracked. I have had trouble from day one with the joint between the two windows that cracked because of the thermal movement, and the dealer had tried a repair four times now under warranty, but it still has failed.  Now I have noticed that the front of the main window is starting to come away from the side of the cabin top, and water is getting under the caulking. It is only a matter of time before the whole window starts to peel away I think.
The problem I believe is thermal expansion, since the window is about 1.5m long, and when it sits in the sun all day, and then cools off at night, the caulking just can not deal with the expansion which is probably more than 10mm.
I will be talking to the dealer this week, but wondered if you ever got your problem solved.  My friend with a Cruiser 34 has a similar problem, and he is having to have his windows removed and reglued for the second time in 5 years. Quite disappointing.
Cheers

[Clivert]

When we bought our 2001 34 one hull window was leaking.
They were bedded in foam tape and at some time when being fitted or refitted the tape had twisted.
Refiited with new sticky backed foam tape and no problem since.
The foam is used on all the hatches too.
Much better than silicon.

[canuck]

As mentioned above - the 2014 and later 37C windows are large plexiglass windows (maybe 1.5m long) bonded to the fibreglass with no frame.  I believe the problem is expansion and contraction and this is overstressing the joints and caulking - if anyone has found a fix for this, I would love to know.  Mine has only failed on the side of the boat facing the sun, in the marina.  The other side is fine.

[WAArete]

Canuck, can you take a photo? I have a 2003, so won't be much help. However, I had a hunter which had a bedded glass. I was told if it's screwed in place, that wasn't correct procedure. Well, it cracked and I removed it and had a replacement built. Comes down to sealant IMHO. Wish you well in your quest to resolve.

[Impavidus]

I have just posted this in another post. I had previously posted it in a post about leaking windows on later boats. There are two issues that are interrelated. Rate of thermal expansion between dissimilar materials and 3 way bonding.

Post;
Not sure if you have the split windows to the cabin? The side windows on later Bavaria's are in two pieces. (as ours) There is a joint between the perspex (plastic glass) which is about an inch wide and is filled with Sikaflex as part of the window bonding to the hull.

This joint has a 3 way bond (two edges and the cabin top). The perspex is held in position by a screw during production (making a hole)
When the screw is removed the joint is filled but the hole is not filled. There is no bond breaker between the cabin top and the Sikaflex at this point .
No mastic, sealant, or similar bonding agent can take being pulled in 3 directions when the boat and windows expand and contract as the temperature goes up and down. The dark windows also expand at a different rate to the white fibreglass deck sides.

This is a well documented known issue in the Facade and glazing industry where a non stick bond breaker is placed to allow the sealant to slide over the 3rd surface (ie the cabin top) but remain bonded to the window edges.

When the joint breaks, which it will at some point, water gets behind the sealant and through the hole Bavaria made and failed to fill in production.

We have had to take remedial action on Impavidus when she was just over a year old, and have seen at least 4 other boats with the same detail that fails.
Sika and Bavaria know about the issue. Sika's data sheet/technical bulletin makes a mention about it somewhere...

Water comes through the holeand runs down behind the inner detailing into the bilge at almost exactly this spot.

The splitting in the mastic/Sika is almost impossible to spot from the outside. But careful inspection sees the mastic de-bonded from the window edge.

This may be the cause of your hidden leak, it's worth a check...   

Hope this helps.

Ant.

 

[whitcd]

Ant,

I have exactly the same problem on my 2015 Bav 41.  Can you tell me what you did to fix the problem?

many thanks

Chris

[Impavidus]

Ant,

I have exactly the same problem on my 2015 Bav 41.  Can you tell me what you did to fix the problem?

many thanks

Chris

Hi Chris.

As we said this is a known problem, unfortunately Bavaria and their franchise's  will not admit it or will keep doing bodge repairs until you give up or live with it.

The problem;

Mastic/sealant joints cannot be pushed or pulled in two planes. IE left right and in out. As the windows expand at a different rate to the cabin top the differential in thermal expansion causes the Mastic /sealant to pull away from one /both of the window edges and also the cabin top between the windows.

In addition Bavaria used a fixing to pull in the window(s) back to the cabin top during production. The fixing creates a hole in the cabin top about 100mm from the base of the window.
When the fixing is removed in production it is not filled with gel coat, just left.

Remedy;

Carefully remove the Mastic /sealant between the windows, cutting back to the gel coat and removing all traces of the sealant. If your careful you can use scotch brite green to abrade it away. Do not over do it and use the scotch brite on the face of the windows. A wooden scraper can be useful for this too. DO NOT USE ACETONE!!!

When the area is cleaned and all the Mastic & Sealant is removed fill the fixing hole with gel coat filler. Cover the gel coat with peal ply or you can use masking tape. `If not you will need to over fill and sand back the filled area.

Add a strip of bond breaker tape over the affected cabin top. This will be an area roughly 20mm by 200mm. Bond breaker tape from Ebay or a good glazing supplies. If not, you can use a non adhesive strip of plastic or polythene and apply this.
You only need to apply it in the area between the windows +2-3mm If your using the latter just lick the first and last 5mm to hold it in place temp. (old facade trick).

Get the Sika product and the primer from Sika in Welwyn Garden City in Hertfordshire England. (There is a how to video they did at the boat show that is really good on YouTube)
You absolutely must use the primer! Or the joint will fail.

Taking your time fill the gap having primed the area along the window sides. Try to avoid primer and sealant on the bond breaker strip.

Tool the product smooth and flush using a silicone squeegee, or a used credit card dipped in soapy water. Level with the window faces. And flush with the existing fillet at the top and bottom of the window.

Cover the area for 48 hours to protect the area from direct sun light.

When the sealant has cured and is firm to the touch, rub your finger over the surface to give it the same appearance as the existing seal.


It will not leak again because the sealant is only being pulled left and right and is not bonded to the area between IE is free to move on the bond breaker. Meanwhile the hole will not let in any water even if the seal fails between. As its now filled.

Hope this helps. If you need any more info PM us and we can talk you through the problem.

Dont forget we have a YouTube channel. Over the winter we will be doing some how too's and maintenance tips.

Ant & Cid xx 

 

 

[whitcd]

Thank you so much, enormously helpful! Another job to add to the list!

[Impavidus]

Thank you so much, enormously helpful! Another job to add to the list!

No problem. 👍