Furling Line Modification ?

[Stuart]

Hi All

We have a lot of friction when pulling the line through the clutch on the combing, it's easier to pull it before the clutch. I was wondering if anyone has the same experience and what did you do to remedy it ?

Cheers

Stuart

[KAOS]

When did you grease the mechanical parts inside the mast and the swivel at the top of the mast? Should be done every year. Spray silicone in the boom outhaul guide.

[Stuart]

When did you grease the mechanical parts inside the mast and the swivel at the top of the mast? Should be done every year. Spray silicone in the boom outhaul guide.

Hi Kaos

The drum for the Genoa furler turns easily, it's just when it passes through the cam clutch in the cockpit it creates a lot of friction.

[Odysseus]

Stuart, If you have got a 140% genny then you need Tarzan to pull it in if you have any sort of wind, Put a stainless rubbing strip on the combing and then to the coach roof winch.

As a side issue when you let out the sail keep a back check on it, don't let it run out or you will get a riding turn in the drum at the very time you don't want it, it's common on this furling.

Regards

Odysseus

[johnpmason]

Stuart,

We had the same problem on our Bav 30.  We now lead the furling line to the aft side winch so that it goes goes round and back to the cockpit, this gives the line a much better lead and makes it much easier to pull.

Regards

john

[Sweet As]

Stuart,

The other 'trick' is to ensure that the foremost furling line fairlead is in the right vertical position to direct the line to the centre of the spool as it winds up (when unfurling the genoa). Too low or too high can lead to overuns etc that can cause problems when it comes time to furl the sail.

[tony from dorset]

Have the same problem i even changed my system to run on the small rollers fitted to stancheons and its still bloody hard i also fitted an extra clutch on coachroof and brought it in a straight line from the drum slightly better but not loads      last year we also had a couple of incidents with a riding turn on the drum and had to drop the sail that was very scary as for our in mast furling no probs

[Nigel]

The other 'trick' is to ensure that the foremost furling line fairlead is in the right vertical position ...

I replaced the first and last blocks with ones that swivel, and positioned them better. A new line may also help, as will bearing lubrication, noted above.

[Stuart]

Thanks for all the replies, I have done a few of them such as the blocks on the stanchions and that improved a little bit. I have to get a better lead from the last stanchion into the cockpit to reduce the friction.

[Bob Baynton]

I had the same problem a year ago and simply adjusting the foremost fairlead seemed to correct the problem. BTW, what have y'all used to lubricate the various blocks? Mine are the originals. Thanks, Bob

[mwcalder]

I have gone through all the hassles already mentioned. The main help was adjusting the balance between fore stay tension and halyard tension. Try slackening halyard a little. Bav36 Beeline

[Ricd]

Bob I use McLube for these tasks. It’s a dry libricantspecifically designed for the task. The problem with silocone spray is over time it attracts dirt which creates friction get in the block bearing.

I have a B34. I grease the furlex top and bottom annually, use McLube on the small blocks on the stanctions and the furling line is lead aft into the cockpit via the reef turning block and then Fairlead on the combing with ss liner dead eye. I have never ever taken the furling line to a winch even in the strongest winds.k

[Salty]

A problem I have seen on several boats including my own, and particularly when mine used to be a charter boat is that the fore sail has not been hoisted high enough. It is important that the foresail halyard makes as broad an angle as possible between it and the forestay where the halyard meets the swivel. If the angle is too shallow there is a real risk of the halyard getting wrapped around the forestay making reefing difficult at best to impossible at worst. Using a winch can put too much strain on the furling line, and on my boat the charterers onboard at the time actually broke the furling line and that turned the situation into a near disaster
When hoisting the foresail, it is all to easy to shackle the tack of the sail to the furling mechanism and hoist the sail until it's tight. That is totally wrong.

What you need to do is to hoist the sail as high as it will go first in order to get the angle between the halyard and the forestay as broad as possible, then look at shackling the tack to the furling mechanism. If it's pretty much there and you are looking at needing to slacken the halyard just a few millimetres only, then it's okay to do so while you fit the shackle and then tighten the halyard again. If you need anything more than a few millimetres do not slacken the halyard, but firstly consider that your sail has either shrunk, or it was cut too small to start off. In this case use a small line some four to six mm diameter and take several turns through the tack of the sail and through the furling gear shackle and pull the turns up as tight as you can before tying the line in place.
If your fore sail is already up and you have had problems with furling it in the past, take a walk along the pontoon with your binoculars and have a good look at the angle between the halyard and the forestay. If it is more or less parallel or with only a very shallow angle, then most likely your furling problems have been because the halyard has wrapped around the forestay. If there is a lot of halyard reaching down to the top of the sail, then it's almost certain it will be at too shallow an angle and a halyard wrap will be the most likely cause of your furling problems.
Lastly, there's nothing wrong with turning your boat either head to wind or a slight angle when wanting to furl, and this will make life easier, as also will reefing before the wind gets too strong.

[Moodymike]

I fitted a jamming block to the stanchion, give a better angle from cockpit. Big improvement.

[Clivert]

I agree with Salty we just turn our 34 into wind slightly if the wind is getting up.
Same with the furling main.
Always thought it to be standard practice ( having sailed with hanked on headsails ).

[patprice]

A sloppy forestay with a curve makes for hard work. Tension the backstay to furl and loosen it later if wanted.

[Kibo]

Not sure how you furl but it takes a lot of load off the forestay furling if you go downwind to about 120 apparent and "blanket" the genoa with the main while furling rather than heading upwind where you are fighting the wind trying to pull the sail in.

[Krill]

Not sure how you furl but it takes a lot of load off the forestay furling if you go downwind to about 120 apparent and "blanket" the genoa with the main while furling rather than heading upwind where you are fighting the wind trying to pull the sail in.

in strong winds that's how i furl mine in ^^ in light winds i will point to the wind slightly and furl it in

i have seen some folk sailing genoa only in a strong blow though and wondered how they furl that in without fighting with it / winching it.

i was always taught if you need to winch it your doing it wrong?

[MarkTheBike]

Hi Kenneth
In strong winds, I frequently sail without the main (slab, not in-mast). If I need to reef further then it's always head-to-wind and hand-pull only. Take up slack in the sheets with a 3/4 turn round each winch to reduce flogging (and extra drag). Previously, I occasionally had to use the winch but after a strip-down and re-grease of the Furlex, hardened the forestay, an extra bullseye and a small mod to the furling drum a couple of years ago, I can hand-reef in anything up to a gusting F8 (I haven't tried in more than that!). Although only a B34, there's only me on board but I was on a Sigma 38 with a similar setup recently (unreefed in F4-F6) and their Furlex was just the same - hand pull only. I suspect that if a winch is needed, in any wind direction, then something needs looking at. I do get the point about reefing on a broad reach but I invariably pack the main away first as it's the hardest work.

[Kibo]

I use the winch in all situations furling the both genoa and main. I don't see anything wrong with using winches for this although of course one needs to be careful in case there is something wrong like an over ride on the drum or if someone hasn't released the lazy sheet !!.

As long as you are aware how much tension and strain you are putting on the furling line if it starts to bind using the winch is OK in my book.

[Salty]

Hi Kenneth
In strong winds, I frequently sail without the main (slab, not in-mast). If I need to reef further then it's always head-to-wind and hand-pull only. Take up slack in the sheets ...............
.....................(usually) there's only me on board.................... I suspect that if a winch is needed, in any wind direction, then something needs looking at. I do get the point about reefing on a broad reach but I invariably pack the main away first as it's the hardest work.

Me too Mark, and I don't like leaving things until the last moment as the harbour can get quite busy with ferries in and out plus other boat movement.

................. I don't see anything wrong with using winches for this although of course one needs to be careful in case there is something wrong.............

As long as you are aware how much tension and strain you are putting on the furling line.............

And that's the point, so long as one is careful and understands how much tension can be put on the furling line. In my case while my boat was being used for bareboat charter, the charterers managed to break an 8 mm furling line that was in good condition, although not brand new. I would estimate that it needed something around 750kg at least to break the furling line. Thereafter and because of worsening weather conditions the charterers were unable to furl the foresail and, because of a halyard wrap as described in my earlier posting, they were unable to lower the foresail. 
At some stage they decided to release the sheets and they undid the figure of eight knots tied in the ends and let them go. The flailing sheets went over the top of the mast, taking the VHF antenna and the wind instrument with them. The sail flogged itself to destruction before they reached somewhere where they could get some shelter. Apart from the sharp pain in the pocket, there were no injuries, but I'm guessing they needed a change of underwear.
The point that both Mark and I are trying to make is that if you need to use a winch because it's too hard to reef the foresail by hand, then something is not set up quite right, and it needs to be found and sorted.
In my experience, a halyard wrap where the foresail has not been hoisted as high as it will go has been a problem on several boats that I have seen. Once the sails have been taken up higher the owners of those other boats have reported that furling the foresail was no longer difficult.

[Ricd]

Even in the strongest wind or even without a main there is never any need to point the boat to the wind. Simply ease the sheet a little to luff the sail a little then wind in some sail in until the sheet is under load again. Going head to wind in a blow means bashing into big waves with effectively no way on therefore no steerage.  In 17 years sailing with furlex I have never used the winch...if you need to winch the reefing line there is something wrong with your set up.

[Ricd]

One other point, my reefing line is port aft. On a stb tack the Genoa port winch is occupied by the sheet. It would not be possible to reef the head sail without either first taking its sheet from the port winch or, alternatively taking the reefing line right across the cockpit, over the binnacle,  to the stb winch or to a coachroof winch, neither of which is practical if single handed or safe with a full cockpit?