Author Topic: High cost of Volvo parts  (Read 11789 times)

Alec

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High cost of Volvo parts
« on: April 03 2014, 07:08 »
Hi All,
I have made comments on this before so decided to put it up as a heading.
As you all know Volvo parts are ridiculously and insultingly expensive and the only way around this is through constent pressure from us the end user or alternatives like after market parts suppliers. Do any of you know of after market parts suppliers for Volvo ?

IslandAlchemy

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Re: High cost of Volvo parts
« Reply #1 on: April 03 2014, 08:55 »
Depends which engine. They're all based on different units from different manufacturers.

landes_h

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Re: High cost of Volvo parts
« Reply #2 on: April 03 2014, 13:49 »
I believe the Volvo Penta's in our Bavaria's are all Perkins Engines.
This one < http://www.perkins.com/cda/files/866860/7/403D-15G%20ElectropaK%20PN1911.pdf > for instance looks very similar to my 29 hp 3 cyl. Volvo MD2030 engine. Of course without the el. generator peripherals.
Also the exhaust system is different, but the core engine is the same.
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tiger79

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Re: High cost of Volvo parts
« Reply #3 on: April 04 2014, 14:35 »
Volvo Penta has one of the best aftersales support organisations in the marine world.  You can get the VP parts you need, virtually off the shelf, in almost any part of the world.  And parts for older engines are available for many years after production ceased.  Unfortunately, it costs a lot to operate that level of service, and this is reflected in the parts prices.  If it's any consolation, parts for other engine makes aren't cheap either.

MarkTheBike

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Re: High cost of Volvo parts
« Reply #4 on: April 06 2014, 11:49 »
Volvo Penta has one of the best aftersales support organisations in the marine world.  You can get the VP parts you need, virtually off the shelf, in almost any part of the world.  And parts for older engines are available for many years after production ceased.  Unfortunately, it costs a lot to operate that level of service, and this is reflected in the parts prices.  If it's any consolation, parts for other engine makes aren't cheap either.
Hi Tiger

Whilst I understand what you're saying about having a world-wide spares availability, I can't agree that overcharging everyone for everything is the way to go about it. They certainly have a massive throughput of stock in the USA, Europe and here in the UK for recent models. And let's face it, if you want to run an older anything that isn't produced any more then you expect to pay extra for parts commensurate with how long it hasn't been produced for. I run a 1982 motorbike. I can assure you that it ain't cheap keeping it on the road, but I expect that - it's 30+ years old. The boat has an MD2030. The spares prices are outrageous. I also have a Volvo car and parts for that can be 200-300% more than equivalent parts for a similar sized Ford or Peugeot. It is my view (I freely admit possibly incorrect) that Volvo desire to be a Prestige brand and so a) tell everyone they are, and b) charge prestige prices. Everything I've seen makes me think that the VP business model is pretty much the same (although not as blatant). It is a shame that there isn't a 'trustworthy' (i.e. not faked in the East) manufacturer producing pattern parts. I would use them every time.

Just my personal opinion, folks. Don't shoot me down in flames, eh?

ATB

M

ps. and before you ask - it was inherited.
ATB

Mark

tiger79

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Re: High cost of Volvo parts
« Reply #5 on: April 06 2014, 20:46 »
Hi Tiger

Whilst I understand what you're saying about having a world-wide spares availability, I can't agree that overcharging everyone for everything is the way to go about it. They certainly have a massive throughput of stock in the USA, Europe and here in the UK for recent models. And let's face it, if you want to run an older anything that isn't produced any more then you expect to pay extra for parts commensurate with how long it hasn't been produced for. I run a 1982 motorbike. I can assure you that it ain't cheap keeping it on the road, but I expect that - it's 30+ years old. The boat has an MD2030. The spares prices are outrageous. I also have a Volvo car and parts for that can be 200-300% more than equivalent parts for a similar sized Ford or Peugeot. It is my view (I freely admit possibly incorrect) that Volvo desire to be a Prestige brand and so a) tell everyone they are, and b) charge prestige prices. Everything I've seen makes me think that the VP business model is pretty much the same (although not as blatant). It is a shame that there isn't a 'trustworthy' (i.e. not faked in the East) manufacturer producing pattern parts. I would use them every time.

Just my personal opinion, folks. Don't shoot me down in flames, eh?

ATB

M

ps. and before you ask - it was inherited.

I don't know whether you have any experience of running a business, but the low volume turnover of older spares (and some newer spares) for VP engines inevitably results in higher prices.  As I said before, it's not just VP either.

MarkTheBike

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Re: High cost of Volvo parts
« Reply #6 on: April 06 2014, 22:16 »
Hi Tiger

Businesses - yes, I've run three over the past 25 years and which allowed me to retire at 51 so not completely crap at it. I have to agree with you that it's not just VP but my last 2 boats ran Yanmars and their engines are just as bullet-proof, but high volume servicing spares were 'Ford' prices. I've also run Mercedes and BMW cars and I see that insufferable supercilious attitude in Volvo that infiltrates those particular car makers. I stand by my view that old and ancient engines should cost more to keep running but surely, spares can be supplied by the after-market factors. Spares for current and recent models should be reasonable and affordable. Volvo are just showing us complete disdain.

Two different viewpoints; who's to know what the real answer is - only the Volvo sales structure, I guess.

ATB

Mark      :D
ATB

Mark

tiger79

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Re: High cost of Volvo parts
« Reply #7 on: April 08 2014, 21:21 »
It's intriguing how people's experiences vary.  I've run Mercs and BMWs for well over 30 years, and wouldn't in any way describe their dealer service as "insufferable" or "supercilious".  In fact, I've found their attitude a hell of a lot more friendly than many Ford dealers.

Spares will only be supplied by aftermarket factors if there's both sufficient demand and sufficient profit.  That's the crux of the matter.  Boat bits are low volume generally, so there's little incentive to offer cheaper options.

As you were successful enough to retire at 51, I guess you'll really understand the business economics involved. 

IslandAlchemy

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Re: High cost of Volvo parts
« Reply #8 on: April 08 2014, 21:56 »
I agree with Mark (about both VP spares and car dealers).

I have to say that my experience with car dealers is that the more expensive the car, the worse the attitude.

Previous cars include:-

Mercs (x2)
Jag XJ8
Range Rover
Ferrari (x2)
Porsche

I now drive a Vauxhall...

tiger79

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Re: High cost of Volvo parts
« Reply #9 on: April 08 2014, 22:13 »
You've obviously chosen the wrong dealers!  We've had about a dozen Mercs, a similar number of BMWs, 3 Ferraris, a couple of Land Rovers and an Audi, and have had generally good experiences with the dealerships.

Alec

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Re: High cost of Volvo parts
« Reply #10 on: April 09 2014, 07:08 »
Hi Tiger and everyone,
I agree with your comments about a need for supply and demand (when that changes there will be cheaper parts) but that still does not distract from the high cost of Volvo parts. For a small engine and compared with other brands that I have maintained over the years Volvo parts are extremely expensive. They are not just making a profit or allowing for product development but effectively "ripping us off" My engine is only 5 years old and maintained to the highest standard so parts are still produced and the same engine still produced. They are charging high prices because they can and this is the place where change can be made, the more feed back and pressure to Volvo and Bavaria the easier it will be to keep those costs under control.
Alec

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Re: High cost of Volvo parts
« Reply #11 on: April 09 2014, 09:16 »
Volvo part are not proprietary items so we all need to look for the original manufactures parts and publish them on this site. They are out there, C.A.V.  Jabsco, Fran, Perkins, just to name a few. Remember Volvo will do their best to stop you, so do not use Volvo numbers.
Look forward to your resaults.
Odysseus
Odysseus

MarkTheBike

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Re: High cost of Volvo parts
« Reply #12 on: April 09 2014, 11:02 »
Of course, Odysseus has hit the nail on the head. Volvo don't make their parts in the first place - they just stick it in a Volvo box and slap a few hundred percent on the unit cost. An OEM number list would go down really well here. See how long before it's blocked, eh?

Salute! Sadly, I had to put up with the more mundane 5's, 7's and SL's. Never even sat in a Ferrari, perhaps I'm a true Volvo owner after all... oh, the shame of it. Good job I did retire; how could I ever hold my head up in such august company.

 ;) ;) ;) ;) ;) ;) ;) ;) ;) ;) ;) ;) ;) ;)
ATB

Mark

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Re: High cost of Volvo parts
« Reply #13 on: April 18 2014, 23:17 »
Volvo part are not proprietary items so we all need to look for the original manufactures parts and publish them on this site. They are out there, C.A.V.  Jabsco, Fran, Perkins, just to name a few. Remember Volvo will do their best to stop you, so do not use Volvo numbers...
That would be very useful, but don't worry about using Volvo numbers, I don't see what they could do to prevent it. I certainly won't interfere, unless compelled by a court order.
Nigel Mercier: Forum Administrator

MarkTheBike

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Re: High cost of Volvo parts
« Reply #14 on: April 24 2014, 10:00 »
http://www.yachtboatparts.com/volvo-penta-md2010-md2020-md2030-md2040-abcd-61-c.asp

If this stuff is genuine then these guys are moving in the right direction. Not big savings but cheaper nonetheless. For the appalling air filter, I've seen a comment on an American site that K&N cone paper filters are a functional alternative. Just discovered that (brilliant design from Volvo's point of view!), if you stick a heavy spring inside a cheap foam filter and place it on top of a vibrating piece of machinery then the filter snaps in half and you can charge £32 for a new one... I'm putting a K&N on mine - enough is enough!

Mark
ATB

Mark

Keiron

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Re: High cost of Volvo parts
« Reply #15 on: July 19 2015, 17:57 »
http://www.yachtboatparts.com/volvo-penta-md2010-md2020-md2030-md2040-abcd-61-c.asp

If this stuff is genuine then these guys are moving in the right direction. Not big savings but cheaper nonetheless. For the appalling air filter, I've seen a comment on an American site that K&N cone paper filters are a functional alternative. Just discovered that (brilliant design from Volvo's point of view!), if you stick a heavy spring inside a cheap foam filter and place it on top of a vibrating piece of machinery then the filter snaps in half and you can charge £32 for a new one... I'm putting a K&N on mine - enough is enough!

Mark

The comment about K&N filters might have been me as I have just replaced the awful plastic box with a totally reusable K&N filter.  For those that might want to look into this option I have a D2-40 and fitted the K&N RC-0890 after consulting with the guys at K&N.  Yes it's not a cheap filter but it's washable and reusable and comes with a 1,000,000 mile warranty (well for cars anyway).

I simply couldn't accept having to pay that much for the plastic box to have to throw it away a year later.

I'm sure there are "aftermarket" fuel and oil filters that cost less than the OEM versions and after the 2 year manufacturers warranty has expired do you have to use OEM parts?

Keiron

Yngmar

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Re: High cost of Volvo parts
« Reply #16 on: July 19 2015, 20:11 »
Volvo parts cost an arm and a leg. However, they're widely and easily available, for engines ranging (I think) about two decades now. This costs a lot of money. When you design and build an engine, there's a lot of custom parts to make, with a variety of production lines to set up. Now to have a steady supply of spares available, you can produce a huge amount of extra parts and then tear down the production lines to free them up for the next engine model. Put all the extra parts you made into a warehouse and then supply them from there. When they run out, that's it, no more exhaust elbows for your engine. When some parts are not needed, because it turns out that part never fails in 20 years, you wasted a lot of money building up and storing stock that will never be needed. The other method is to keep the production lines and keep making parts on demand (or rather, in batches). You can supply parts for as long as you want, but you have to house, operate, train staff, etc. for a large variety of engine parts production. Either method costs a lot of money, which is a big part of why these stupid parts cost so much money. Another part is no doubt profit, and I'm sure there's a nice bit of that in the spare parts business, but not as much as many boat owners think.

Now "putting pressure" on Volvo is unlikely to impress them. The one thing that boat owners can do would be to say "I'm not buying anything with a Volvo in it". While some certainly do, that doesn't seem to be the case much, or production boat companies would long have switched to another supplier (they want to make profits too).

What we boat owners can do, is get a bit smarter about where and how we buy parts. Not all parts of a Volvo engine are actually made by Volvo, many of them are either standard parts, or custom parts by another company. If they're standard parts (like an alternator belt, oil or fuel filter), you can buy them from any car shop, just need to look up the right one. If they're custom parts (like my raw water impeller pump, which is made by Jabsco), they may be available from the supplier, but not always, or they may be used in other engines where they're available as spares for less money. The difficulty here is to find matching ones. This also plays a role in spare part prices by the way, as if a third party supplier stops making an item, Volvo will have to find another one or start producing it themselves.

And finally, not all Volvo Penta engines are actually designed by Volvo. For example, my MD22 was designed by Perkins. I know it's a Perkins Prima M60, so I can buy parts for that which are identical. Apart from the marinized bits (heat exchanger and cooling system). And there's a Haynes manual for it, because it was the engine for the Austin/Rover Montego 2.0 Diesel (which is better than the Volvo workshop manual in many ways, because it tells you which standard tool to use of "Volvo special single-purpose tool with part no. XYZ").

Lastly, there's the used parts and engines market. There are some parts available on eBay, and there are whole used engines there as well. I know at least one mariner who bought a used engine (a Yanmar in this case of the same model as his) and stripped it down for parts. This is of course only an option if you have a place to keep it all (or the patience to flog parts below original prices on eBay).

Also keep in mind, in some cases it may cost less to repair rather than replace, or even get a spare part made in a machine shop rather than buying it from Volvo.

So what we can do is share such information, e.g. which Volvo part numbers cross-reference to other manufacturers or where you got a part made or repaired. Hope this helps!
(formerly) Sailing Songbird  ⛵️ Bavaria 40 Ocean (2001)

Ripster

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Re: High cost of Volvo parts
« Reply #17 on: July 30 2015, 19:53 »
I took a punt with a K&N 890 as my D1-30 uses the same VP OE part no.  I like K&N products as I used to use them on various bikes and car in the past.  However, my concern was the likely increased level of induction noise, but I thought it worth a try. 

On trying it today (went straight on) the induction noise is significantly more.  A hollow deep sound that is not there with the OE filter box - so I took it back off.  Don't want more noise in the boat under engine.  So the K&N route is no good for me.  Anyone know of another alternative cheaper (then the VP part) solution that maintains the same noise level as the OE?

http://www.yachtboatparts.com/volvo-penta-md2010-md2020-md2030-md2040-abcd-61-c.asp

If this stuff is genuine then these guys are moving in the right direction. Not big savings but cheaper nonetheless. For the appalling air filter, I've seen a comment on an American site that K&N cone paper filters are a functional alternative. Just discovered that (brilliant design from Volvo's point of view!), if you stick a heavy spring inside a cheap foam filter and place it on top of a vibrating piece of machinery then the filter snaps in half and you can charge £32 for a new one... I'm putting a K&N on mine - enough is enough!

Mark



The comment about K&N filters might have been me as I have just replaced the awful plastic box with a totally reusable K&N filter.  For those that might want to look into this option I have a D2-40 and fitted the K&N RC-0890 after consulting with the guys at K&N.  Yes it's not a cheap filter but it's washable and reusable and comes with a 1,000,000 mile warranty (well for cars anyway).

I simply couldn't accept having to pay that much for the plastic box to have to throw it away a year later.

I'm sure there are "aftermarket" fuel and oil filters that cost less than the OEM versions and after the 2 year manufacturers warranty has expired do you have to use OEM parts?

Keiron

tiger79

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Re: High cost of Volvo parts
« Reply #18 on: July 30 2015, 20:40 »

I simply couldn't accept having to pay that much for the plastic box to have to throw it away a year later.


Just because Volvo Penta suggest a replacement cycle doesn't mean you have to follow it.  I was chatting to a VP dealer technician the other day and he said that they don't automatically replace air filters, because of their cost, but examine them and only change them if they look dirty.  As most boat engines don't run in dirty environments, the filters rarely need replacing.