Cruiser 46 Style takes water into bilge compartments, but why? Need help

[Fernlicht]

Hello All,
We discovered that problem just last year (directly after warranty:( on our 2017/18 Crusier 46 Style)
and tried a lot to reproduce it. The local shipyard here has no clue why and tried to figure it out over the winter season... no luck

But I start from the start.
- 1st. We discovered a strange smell of old water (a little bit like a wet dog or so) from the heating/aircon when turned on after sailing in +20kts wind.
- 2nd. After 2 months when coming back to the boat the smell was gone. But came directly again after sailing...
- 3rd i looked into all (bilge) compartments and I saw there is around 5 Liter water, sometimes more a bit more sometimes none (more when sailing with a lot of heal ~20* degrees) The water looks a bit yellow with greenish sediment inside. Pls have a look at the picture. I tasted a drop and I think it is a bit salty, but not like saltwater.
- 4th I took all fresh water out of the front tank and the problem  seemed to be away.
- 5th But when we sailed just yesterday (1st time this year) with an empty front tank we took water in again (wind 25kts healing up to 20*) but only 2-3 Liter.
- 6th it is strange since it mostly happens in the bilge compartments in the front master cabin between the toilet and shower (as you can see in the attached pictures) the other compartments and the bilge itself are desert dry.
 
Have you every heard about such a thing?
Any suggestion why that happens or what to look for? What to check to circle around the problem?

All the best

 

[nightowle]

Is it possibly coming from shower use?  The best test is to place talcum powder (or similar) within any area you can reach under floor boards, other than where the water is finally accumulating.  It should direct you to the source of trouble.

[Fernlicht]

Thanks for the suggestion, it does not seem to be the shower, but the Talkum idea is good. I‘ll give it a try. I thought about also the keel bolts. Maybe somebody should look at them too?

[GeoffV]

That would be serious.
 I suggest before you go out next time to block various compartments of the keel bolts in order to check that is not the problem.
Then do the same for other areas to nail it down along with the powder.

[SYJetzt]

To eliminate the root cause with the keel bolts you can easily block the holes to the other compartments using butyl tape plugs. If the compartment stays dry (after sailing and heeling), you can remove the butyl without remnants and maybe see the from where the water is coming, if it had been retained beyond the plug. It seems pretty unlikely, that the leak is next to the keel bolts. The most likely cause are the railing stanchions or the hull-deck joint (see a lot of posts on this site!).   

[Fernlicht]

Ok, if understood right tomorrow I get duck tape and a plastic bag and divide the compartments and see if the water gets inside from the keelbolts or from the side compartments which are connected together through tubes.

I also thought to wrap tissues around ever tube/seacock in the front, if they get wet...

Ps you know I had the boat out of the water and there was nothing to see between keel and hull,
No dents, cracks, nothing just pure white gel coat. So I guess/hope it has nothing to do with the keel or connections.

I do all of the suggestions tomorrow and go sailing the next days and report back
Thanks for your input!

[symphony2]

Highly unlikely it will be keel bolts unless you have seriously grounded the boat and opened up the keel/hull joint. That would also lead to severe damage to the reinforcing grid in the bottom of the boat and there is no sign of that in your photos. The keel is glued to the hull as well as bolted. Leakage through bolts is virtually unknown. At that end of the  boat there are only two possible sources of water. First and most obvious is from the fresh water system. Second is from the outside through the hull deck joint, deck fittings or the anchor locker. The silt in the water suggests possibly the latter.

[Jam]

I ve spent a long time tracing leaks on my Bavaria ocean 38, there were lots.  It sounds to me you have a freshwater leak and the water is trapped somewhere and is stale and appears once you heal over whilst sailing.  Difficult to make a comparison as my boat is a lot older than yours.  In my case I found main leaks were the stantions, fresh water filler pipe and the hull/ deck joint which seemed to be leaking in numerous places. I also reseated/sealed hatches ect in my attempt find/eliminate possible sources. The best advise I got was from other Bavaria ocean 38/40 owners as they had similar issues so helped me narrow it down a bit and have some idea before I tacked the leaks. Fortunately I could access most areas to look for the leaks from inside of the boat by removing panels in cupboards however the moulded cabin roof makes this tricky when checking fitting on the top of the cabin, I  also removed some light fittings and panels around mast step inside boat, removable panels are much better than a moulded cabin liner. I would attempt to trace another similar boat owner if you can find one as it’s likely they are having the same issues.  I found water in different bilge areas didn’t help me narrow it down as had to look higher up for the leak...it only helped me narrow it down to say a cabin area....you could block off any holes temporarily  that link bilge areas to prevent water flowing from one bilge/cabin area to the next?  A dehumidifier helped to eliminate condensation drips in winter so again made tracing leaks slightly easier..good luck.
John

[Markus]

Ok, if understood right tomorrow I get duck tape and a plastic bag and divide the compartments and see if the water gets inside from the keelbolts or from the side compartments which are connected together through tubes.

I also thought to wrap tissues around ever tube/seacock in the front, if they get wet...

Ps you know I had the boat out of the water and there was nothing to see between keel and hull,
No dents, cracks, nothing just pure white gel coat. So I guess/hope it has nothing to do with the keel or connections.

I do all of the suggestions tomorrow and go sailing the next days and report back
Thanks for your input!

In your original post you mention "I tasted a drop and I think it is a bit salty, but not like saltwater". This already rules out keel bolts and through hulls. If it was sea water, it would be clearly at least as salty as sea water and not "perhaps a bit salty". So I would focus on finding leaks above water line after making double sure the leak is not from the tanks and water pipes inside the boat. A water hose and another set of eyes with possibly an endoscope depending on your boat structure might help.

[Salty]

I would be looking at the mast earthing cable to determine whether water was running down that cable from above, also from the mast itself. Many boats have a section of the cabin deckhead that can be taken down to allow access to the mast cabling. Whenever a mast is taken down, all of the cables that go up the mast would need to be disconnected within that removeable section of the deck head lining. Checking there, particularly after heavy rainfall or after sailing and taking lots of spray on the mast might reveal leakage through deck fittings which then runs down the mast support post inside the rectangular panelling seen in your first photo. It can be a real pain in the @#&% to fix so I hope that investigation shows the area to be fully dry. Talcum powder or blue tissue paper left in strategic places can help to identify the presence of water. Good luck in your investigations.

[Brian]

Over the years I have had 2/3 water leaks that work their way to the bilges. 
1. The water heater was the worst offender and was replaced.
2. The stern shower, this stopped when I stopped using it. Have still not worked out where the leak is.
3.  The swimming ladder screws and cover screws needed resealing.