Author Topic: Cruiser 33 BONDING A RUDDER TUBE  (Read 2357 times)

ANTREVELL

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Cruiser 33 BONDING A RUDDER TUBE
« on: November 09 2020, 09:07 »
Cruiser 33 2014

My neighbour had a siezed rudder on his Bavaria sailing boat which is older than mine . He was told the main reason was the rudder tube was not bonded and the aluminium corroded and swelled hence damaging the bearings . And apparently this is a very common problem.

My boat came with a small anode fitted to the rear of the hull  but the rudder tube does not appear to be bonded to that . Apparently these days the rudder tube is bonded to this rear anode that is fixed to the hull .

My plastic washer between the rudder and the hull has cracked which would suggest that maybe the rudder tube is swelling . Does anybody know if it safe to bond the rudder tube . My concern is I was always told the gearbox of the saildrive should not be bonded and I wondered if in some way the rudder tube and steering cables would in some way connect to the gearbox .

Can anyone with a new Bavaria sail boat confirm their rudder tube is now bonded

Regards Tony  Revell

HappyAfloat

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Re: Cruiser 33 BONDING A RUDDER TUBE
« Reply #1 on: November 09 2020, 10:11 »
I have read that a corroded aluminium rudder tube is caused by using copper based antifouling and that a non-copper should be used near the rudder stock area.

However, it is a common problem.  One of my previous boats had a cracked bearing which I replaced for the Jeffa alternative.

symphony2

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Re: Cruiser 33 BONDING A RUDDER TUBE
« Reply #2 on: November 09 2020, 10:40 »
https://jefa.dk/electrolysis/ You will find this useful as it explains the "problem" and possible remedies. However, in reality on Bavarias, the only big issue is antifoul around the lower bearing housing and protruding rudder stock, and this is easily avoided. The interface between steering and the rudder stock via the autopilot connection does not seem to be a problem, neither does the engine control path because the mount is not connected electrically to the steering mechanism as it would be in a conventional pedestal.

While later boats such as my 2015 (same as yours) 33 do indeed have a small hull anode, it is unclear what it is connected to, but as far as I can see it is not connected to the rudder stock or tube.

While it is true that seized lower bearings are not uncommon in older Bavarias, it is not a lack of anodes that causes it, but antifoul applied too close to the shaft (or indeed on the shaft itself if the application is enthusiastic).

ANTREVELL

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Re: Cruiser 33 BONDING A RUDDER TUBE
« Reply #3 on: November 14 2020, 19:04 »
Thank you for the replies .  For your information

 I have traced the earth bonding from the stern hull anode . The cable connects to the diesel  tap and from there it loops round to the inline fuel filter in the engine bay.  There is also a  wire spilt in the hot water tank compartment where another wire connects to the engine.  As far as I can see these are the only connections . None of my seacocks are bonded

Can you please confirm again  that your rudder tube is not bonded and whether your plastic washer has cracked.

As my neighbour who had the siezed rudder tells me Bavaria told him the rudder tube should be bonded.

Regards Tony

symphony2

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Re: Cruiser 33 BONDING A RUDDER TUBE
« Reply #4 on: November 15 2020, 13:03 »
I assume your neighbour's boat is an older J&J design, in which case if you google Bavaria rudder bearing replacement you will find a lot of information, in particular a youtube that shows what the problem is and how to replace the lower bearing. Seizure of the rudder is caused by one of two things, most common is the seizure of the lower composite bearing in the aluminium housing - as in the video, and the second, less common is the rudder stock seizing in the bearing because of corrosion of the stock itself.

Unfortunately there is a lot of misunderstanding of galvanic corrosion. It occurs when two dissimilar metals are in contact in an electrolyte (seawater). The most common examples are brass alloy props on stainless shafts such as fitted to most modern shaft drive boats. It is the zinc in the propeller that erodes leaving just copper, so the solution is to introduce an additional amount of zinc electrically bonded to the assembly, such as a shaft anode or an anode attached to the hull close to the assembly and bonded to the shaft with a wire, often by being attached to the engine/gearbox that the shaft is attached to. In the case of a saildrive, the two metals are aluminium for the housing and stainless for the shaft, bearings and fastenings. This is protected by isolating the whole drive from the rest of the boat (including the engine AND propeller) and attaching an anode to the housing. The video is wrong in suggesting the rudder should be bonded to the saildrive anode. If a folding or feathering prop is fitted, it is still isolated from the drive and may have its own anodes because mixed metals (usually brass alloys and stainless steel) are used in the mechanism. Most of the alloys are very corrosion resistant and anodes are small, or even non existent as in my older FlexoFold 2 blade, but others require larger anodes with short life.

Getting back to the bearing housing that is the root cause of most rudder seizures, you will see that it is not made of two dissimilar metals immersed in seawater, so bonding to an anode as the narrator suggested will not stop the corrosion. The cause is staring him in the face in the video - it is the copper based antifouling that coats the aluminium housing, and it is the copper that is the second metal. If you look at your saildrive manual it stresses the need to use a copper free antifoul such as Trilux on the aluminium housing. Exactly the same should be used to antifoul the area of the hull around the bearing housing - usually a 10cm circle.

No anode was fitted to earlier Bavarias because none was needed. The one fitted to the current boats is there to comply with RCD requirements for the electrical system. As you have discovered it is not connected to anything in the steering system, although I think that the lower bearing design is different from the earlier boats. There has never been any need to bond seacocks in a GRP boat because there are no dissimilar metals in contact with seawater. Corrosion of seacocks and fittings happens because some are plain brass (copper and zinc) and not corrosion resistant in seawater, although in reality even these can take many years to show any signs of dezincification. Attaching an anode will not make any difference to this type of corrosion.

The boat shown in the video is the same as my old 37 which I had for 14 years from new and no sign of stiff rudder when I sold it. The video does make the point that the boat was left for long periods in the water unused and this makes the build up of corrosion in the housing worse as regular use rubs the deposits away. As he said, take the boat out of the water and the shaft and bearing lose lubricating water and seize.

Hope you (and others) find this explanation useful. 

Salty

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Re: Cruiser 33 BONDING A RUDDER TUBE
« Reply #5 on: November 16 2020, 07:21 »
Very good explanation Symphony2.

ANTREVELL

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Re: Cruiser 33 BONDING A RUDDER TUBE
« Reply #6 on: November 16 2020, 08:49 »
Hi

Thankyou for the very good explanation . My concern started because the plastic washer approx 1/4 inch thick Which is fitted on the rudder metal rod  between the rudder blade and the hull has cracked. I assume it is only there to prevent the rudder being driven up to the hull So acts as a spacer.   I initially assumed it had cracked because it had hit the hull. But then began to wonder if the rudder metal rod Had in fact corroded and expanded hence cracking the spacer.
I felt it would be prudent to remove rudder to check and replace the spacer.  It would appear not all Bavarias have this washer fitted.

Sorry not sure what the rudder rod or shaft is really called.

Regards Tony

Yngmar

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Re: Cruiser 33 BONDING A RUDDER TUBE
« Reply #7 on: November 16 2020, 19:09 »
Are you sure your washer has cracked and it wasn't an originally split washer? This would normally be the case, as the washers are there to make up for tolerances in the finished boats (that's why they vary between boats), so they're split to make it possible to simply slip one onto the slightly lowered rudder post without having to entirely remove the rudder out of the hull again.
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Moodymike

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Re: Cruiser 33 BONDING A RUDDER TUBE
« Reply #8 on: November 16 2020, 22:57 »
I can vouch for the cracked washer. Has happened to my B32 (2003) about two seasons ago. Have convinced myself that it easier to leave it rather than remove the rudder even if I could find a replacement  Looking at various Bavaria’s all models appear to have different sizes of spacers.