Author Topic: Bow Anchor Roller mod on Vision 46  (Read 5208 times)

Kibo

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Bow Anchor Roller mod on Vision 46
« on: April 03 2018, 17:03 »
We anchor most of the time and here in  the Caribbean that is in quite strong winds which puts a strain on the bow roller and the anchor housing. We realised that the anchor roller housing Bavaria uses is really not strong enough for repeated use in these conditions and was actually bending and starting to crack at the most forward point just behind the anchor roller. Not good for our peace of mind when sleeping!

We have had a local welder reinforce this entire assembly by adding on 6mm plate on either side and the base of the forward section. He also added a strengthening "arch" between the two forward vertical sections which helps to stop the bending as the boat swings on anchor

I thought this might be helpful especially if you have a Vision 46 or 42. Our hull design seems to swing much more in the wind which exacerbates the problem.

Here are some photos of the modification.
Ian
SV Kibo, 2014 Bavaria Vision 46

Yngmar

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Re: Bow Anchor Roller mod on Vision 46
« Reply #1 on: April 04 2018, 11:42 »
We just switched to a snubber with a bridle that goes to the two bow cleats. Removes the load from the bow assembly entirely and moves it to the far stronger cleats. We switched from a single snubber to the bridle due to similar concerns (we have a swiveling bow roller), and also because it should reduce swinging (the boat "tacking" with the wind) at anchor a bit.

Haven't tried it yet, but we'll be leaving our winter hideout and back to anchoring again in a few weeks :)
(formerly) Sailing Songbird  ⛵️ Bavaria 40 Ocean (2001)

Kibo

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Re: Bow Anchor Roller mod on Vision 46
« Reply #2 on: April 04 2018, 16:31 »
Hi Ingmar

We tried the bridle but the bow of the Vision series is too plumb for a dual bridle to go to the bow cleats. The snubber line ends up under the bow alternately on either side as the boat swings and the line chafed through on the anchor locker drain covers (clamshell style in our boat). We tried several iterations without success. It simply isn't possible to get the line tight enough to stop it falling by too far down and catching on the drain covers

I guess on your boat that doesn’t happen if your bow has more of an angle to it. Watch out if you have anchor locker drain covers though.

Have a great season. Ours is almost over in the Caribbean and we are about to haul out for the hurricane season. Hopefully not as bad as last year
Ian
SV Kibo, 2014 Bavaria Vision 46

Yngmar

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Re: Bow Anchor Roller mod on Vision 46
« Reply #3 on: April 04 2018, 17:04 »
Ah, good point. Didn't think about that - our bow is well angled.

Cheers!
(formerly) Sailing Songbird  ⛵️ Bavaria 40 Ocean (2001)

rbrtmccorkle

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Re: Bow Anchor Roller mod on Vision 46
« Reply #4 on: April 05 2018, 18:40 »
Sharing some very good points on anchoring in high winds from Skip Novak.   I actually crewed on the same type of boat Bernard Moitessier used in the first solo round the world.  Atillio the Captain of SV KSAR, anchored in 60+ knot winds on a single anchor chain.  This was done in the exact spot Skip is using for this attached YouTube link.  Like Skip, Capt. Attillio used a single chain (all chain and lots of it) with a snubber to take pressure of windless. We spent the night in this anchorage and wind was even higher overnight with no issues.  Skip & Attilio's technics were virtually the same. 

https://youtu.be/rYfoki6vW-M

Bob
SV Chaos
BAV O42

Kibo

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Re: Bow Anchor Roller mod on Vision 46
« Reply #5 on: April 05 2018, 20:04 »
Thanks Bob, useful.

I too use single slightly overweight anchor - in this case a Delta not a CQR, I had a CGR on a previous Bav 42 and hated it, wouldn't set for toffee. I am thinking of moving to a Rocna since I hear nothing but good things although the Delta has worked OK so far and we try to anchor in sand only where possible.

All chain rode, I carry 300 feet, snubbing line back to my bow cleat with heavyweight rubber snubber attached as a shock absorber. I use 7:1 scope in any wind over 20 knts over the deck. 5:1 below that (obviously depending on what other boats have out too - I usually ask if anyone is close in my swinging area).

My new reinforced bow roller set up is a dream. Much quieter at night when swinging and obviously more secure than the skinny Bavaria supplied set up.

Happy sailing !
Ian
SV Kibo, 2014 Bavaria Vision 46

Craig

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Re: Bow Anchor Roller mod on Vision 46
« Reply #6 on: April 06 2018, 02:08 »
We successfully anchored our Bav 38 ( 2010 model) in winds gusting between 40kns and 75kns for 3 days in Pula, Croatia. We had 60m of chain out in 4 m of water using a Kobra 23kg anchor. ( Kobra 23 kg was largest anchor we could fit on our roller ) When the winds reached over 50kns we deployed our CQR ( The one that came with the boat) on about 20m of chain much closer to the boat. The second anchor reduced the yawing. Before deployment of the second anchor the wind gusts were lying the boat over so far I would be rolled over in bed. The chain was so straight, it did not touch the water for 2 to 3 boat lengths in front of the boat.

We were anchored in the bay near the colosseum and had no wave action. The additional loading on the chain in these conditions is not a shock loading when the boat changes directions but a loading that might approach 1 1/2 to 2 times the standard strain. (There is a web site produced by a french sailor with these calculations)  . We divided the strain between the deck cleats using a short nylon snubber to protect the windlass and had lines from the cleats back to the main genoa winches as a precaution against the cleat being pulled out of the deck. If you need to anchor in strong winds, I recommend that it is more important to be away from wave action than away from the wind.

Most anchor tests show the concave shaped anchors hold greater loads than the plough type anchors. But, beware, if they have roll bars, they may collect a lot of weed. We have seen a number of these anchors fail to set as a ball of weed clogs the anchor. The plough shaped anchors tend to shed the weed more easily.This could be dangerous when the wind changes directions.

The beauty of laying 2 anchors, one behind the other is that, if one drags, then you can let out additional chain on the other to tension both anchors. Our 2nd anchor was not used to divide the load as such but to reduce yawing. By reducing the yawing and taking some of the load, it contributed as much holding as the main anchor.

A simple vector diagram will show that laying 2 anchors in a V pattern in strong winds will do nothing to reduce tension on the boat. It will mean that the load is merely transferred from one anchor to the other when yawing and will do little to reduce yawing. With 2 anchors in a V pattern you are more likely to tangle the anchors if one anchor drags or the wind changes direction, even a little.

Catenary is a myth in strong winds. Do not invest in heavier chain but invest in the largest anchor that will fit on your boat. Never buy a CQR, all the recent anchor tests show the problem that they take longer to set when pulled out and their holding is not as good as the Kobra or Delta designs.

I now have a fortress as a spare anchor. It suspect it would not be as good as even a CQR to stop yawing but it would be good as a kedge anchor to pull me off a sandbank. With a small fender, I can swim out with the fortress ( 7 kgs) and drop it in the water away from the boat. ( Nylon rode only). Beware of the Fortress or danforth type anchors, particularly in the med, as they are difficult to remove if they pick up a chain from the bottom. Took nearly 1 hour, and using a mallet, to bash a chain out of the gap between the flukes and the shank on a neighbours boat after they picked up my chain.

When attaching a snubber, always, if possible, attach to the chain between the roller and the water and lead back 2 lines, one to each cleat. I can't speak for most boats but one mine, I think I am more likely to pull the windlass out than wreck the bow roller.

Craig
"Shirley Valentine"
Gold Coast
Australia

Kibo

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Re: Bow Anchor Roller mod on Vision 46
« Reply #7 on: April 06 2018, 02:15 »
Seems my post has transitioned into anchor and anchoring technique recommendations. All good

I'm with Craig as you saw above re CQR (POS, as I like to call it). AsI also said above sometimes with bow design taking 2 lines (bridle) to either bow cleat isn't practical or possible like on our boat model so I think our solution to strengthen the bow roller assembly was a good solution for us combined with the other recommendations here.

Hope it helps other members with similar new style plumb bow designs.

Have a safe night on the hook - I am about to....
Ian
SV Kibo, 2014 Bavaria Vision 46