Author Topic: high water bilge alarm (Read 8315 times)

Sam Ward · « **on:** May 05 2017, 16:03 »

Has anyone installed / have experience with a high water bilge alarm?

When we bought our 2004 Bav 32 last Fall the surveyor recommended we install one. I guess it should be a few inches above the float switches on our bilge pumps, but wanted to check and see if anyone had experience with this. Thanks!

IslandAlchemy · « **Reply #1 on:** May 05 2017, 16:47 »

My float switch activates and alarm aswell as a pump. This allows us to have the pump switched off when on board, but if we start taking on water, the alarm will still sound.

Lyra · « **Reply #2 on:** May 06 2017, 15:24 »

I too have the alarm work together with the float switch.
I would not like to have the float switch "silently" activating the pump, since float activation already indicates that there may be a problem that should be checked.
Never thought of adding another alarm in case the float switch does not work (I simply make sure on a regular basis that it is free and activates the pump)

Ripster · « **Reply #3 on:** May 07 2017, 00:35 »

Same here. Ours has alarm and pump on the same switch.

tiger79 · « **Reply #4 on:** May 07 2017, 17:07 »

I only have dust in the bilges!

artemis · « **Reply #5 on:** May 07 2017, 17:51 »

Hi There

Same on Artemis alarm and switch same unit but never get water in there or very seldom.

Mike
Artemis

Kibo · « **Reply #6 on:** May 07 2017, 18:51 »

I have a separate high water alarm activated by a float switch which is about 9" above the lowest part of the bilge floor. My main bilge pump has a separate float switch at the bilge floor level. Secondary manual switched bilge pump also.

Craig · « **Reply #7 on:** May 07 2017, 23:24 »

Tiger79's experience is also my experience.

If you have anything but dust in your bilge, you have a problem that needs fixing.

Common causes of water in any of the bilges are:
1. busted fresh water fittings. The first join after the hot water tank is a common weak spot.
2. leak in engine exhaust, primarily small holes in Volvo wet exhaust.
3. rain water leaks from Deck/Hull join leak, or leaks around sugar scoop. Also leaks around cleats.
4. Busted heat exchanger in hot water tank causing water to flow out of the engine coolant header tank when the water pump is turned on.
5. Salt water leak from behind the salt water impellor requiring seal replacement.
6. Holding tank leak.

If you have an automatic bilge pump fitted it should have an alarm sound if it activates.

If you have a manually operated bilge pump then you will obviously know when there is a problem.
Craig
"Shirley Valentine"
Gold Coast
Australia

Salty · « **Reply #8 on:** May 08 2017, 06:27 »

Quote from: Craig on May 07 2017, 23:24

If you have anything but dust in your bilge, you have a problem that needs fixing.

Common causes of water in any of the bilges are:
1. busted fresh water fittings. The first join after the hot water tank is a common weak spot.
2. leak in engine exhaust, primarily small holes in Volvo wet exhaust......
AND ALSO ALLOWING CARBON MONOXIDE GAS INTO THE CABIN ATMOSPHERE.
3. rain water leaks from Deck/Hull join leak, or leaks around sugar scoop. Also leaks around cleats.
4. Busted heat exchanger in hot water tank causing water to flow out of the engine coolant header tank when the water pump is turned on.
5. Salt water leak from behind the salt water impellor requiring seal replacement.
6. Holding tank leak.

Plus see the modification at point 2 above, and

7. A problem with your keel attachment to the hull, perhaps caused by a heavy grounding.

Sam Ward · « **Reply #9 on:** May 08 2017, 11:33 »

Thanks for your replies - very helpful. The surveyor's recommendation to install the high water bilge alarm was more related to general safety. We haven't had any water in the bilge itself, but we have had some in the engine compartment, which at time of survey was believed to be the cause of a leaking water pump.

We replaced the water pump right away, but I still find fresh water in the engine compartment from time to time. I've been thinking this must be caused by the broken freshwater fittings, because the water appears regardless of whether I've been running the engine or we've had any rain. The challenge now will be to figure out which one of those t-fittings is the source of the leak. The longer list of potential water issues is great to have in case I have other problems in future.

I think I will install the high water bilge alarm in the bilge area at bottom of companion way stair, next to the primary and auxiliary bilge pumps, in case these stop working.

Kibo · « **Reply #10 on:** May 08 2017, 12:33 »

My high water alarm is a back up safety system too.

I have dry bilges most of the time but if you have aircon units and lots of refridgeration then condensate can be a cause of a small amount of fresh water especially if the sump accumulator boxes block up so in my experience it's an ongoing routine maintenance issue...

One comment on your possible fresh water system leak... if you have electric on demand pump pressure water system then the pump will cycle every so often if you have a leaky system since it is operated by a pressure switch so when you open a tap the pump comes on. Open the cabin sole boards where the pump is and listen for it to run for a short burst intermittently. It might happen only once a minute if it is a very small leak but it is a definite tell tale that you have a leak somewhere in your plumbing. If it doesnt do that then I would look elsewhere for the source of your freshwater.....

Good luck!

mikeiso1192 · « **Reply #11 on:** May 08 2017, 16:47 »

Sam
Another possibility is that in wet weather, water flowing from the cockpit through the transom opening ie over the pvc deck at the top of the rudder post is tracking down the 4 self tapper screws holding the pvc panel down and then flowing back to the engine bilge. Those screws over time and crew walking through cause the screw holes to enlarge and need resealing regularly. Winter 2015/16 we collected approx 200 litres this way.
Mike

tiger79 · « **Reply #12 on:** May 08 2017, 18:06 »

Quote from: Kibo on May 08 2017, 12:33

One comment on your possible fresh water system leak... if you have electric on demand pump pressure water system then the pump will cycle every so often if you have a leaky system since it is operated by a pressure switch so when you open a tap the pump comes on. Open the cabin sole boards where the pump is and listen for it to run for a short burst intermittently. It might happen only once a minute if it is a very small leak but it is a definite tell tale that you have a leak somewhere in your plumbing.

Not necessarily. Faulty valves in the pump can allow backflow and cause the pump to cycle without there being any actual leak of water.

Kibo · « **Reply #13 on:** May 08 2017, 18:47 »

Yes, but if the pump cycles and he actually has a leak its is a good indicator that is from the system, would be pretty coincidental to be a leak AND a pump seal I would think. It has happened a couple of times to me.......

Salty · « **Reply #14 on:** May 08 2017, 18:55 »

Quote from: mikeiso1192 on May 08 2017, 16:47

Sam
Another possibility is that in wet weather, water flowing from the cockpit through the transom opening ie over the pvc deck at the top of the rudder post is tracking down the 4 self tapper screws holding the pvc panel down and then flowing back to the engine bilge. Those screws over time and crew walking through cause the screw holes to enlarge and need resealing regularly. Winter 2015/16 we collected approx 200 litres this way.
Mike

Yes, I mentioned about this in a reply to another thread. The problem on my boat was cured by changing the screws to bolts, and by using an "O" ring around each bolt but between the the pvc panel and the hull/transom moulding. This has solved the problem and I've had no more water leaks through the old screw holes.

Sam Ward · « **Reply #15 on:** May 09 2017, 05:28 »

I pumped the engine compartment out but after two days of heavy rains returned to find about a litre of water. I spent much of the day wondering whether the transom / cockpit deck area leak might be coming from, then returned home to see posts above from Mikeiso1192 and Salty, and this sounds like it must be the source. I will investigate the deck plate screws tomorrow and see if they need re-bedding. Thanks guys. This is the biggest problem I've faced since buying the boat and sounds like you may have hit on the answer.

Salty · « **Reply #16 on:** May 09 2017, 09:59 »

Sam, on my boat the holes into which those self tappers fitted were of the sort of size where you could stand back ten feet and throw the screws in !! I don't know for sure why they were so enlarged, but in hunting for the source of the leak that was resulting in the inboard aft corner of the mattress in my starboard cabin getting wet. It turned out that water was dripping off one of the screws and on to a wire which ran forward descending slightly until it was just inside the area where the steering cables were. Then the water dropped off, and worked its way through the poorly sealed joint between centreline bulkhead and the plastics that surround that area, and on to the corner of the mattress. Since then, no further problems. I might have used rubber grommets rather than "O" rings, but either will do. Tightening the bolts can be tricky if you are on your own, but not impossible 👹

Sam Ward · « **Reply #17 on:** May 10 2017, 04:16 »

Follow-up question for Mikeiso1192 and Salty...

Guys, do the attached photos show the same transom plate that you had problems with? Do the screw holes and decking look like they could be the cause of a liter of water in the engine compartment over two days of rain? I would agree this looks like a mess but screw holes weren't quite as bad as I was expecting. Open to advice here and wondering what other leak sources I should be checking....

Salty · « **Reply #18 on:** May 10 2017, 06:45 »

Quote from: Sam Ward on May 10 2017, 04:16

Follow-up question for Mikeiso1192 and Salty...

Guys, do the attached photos show the same transom plate that you had problems with? Do the screw holes and decking look like they could be the cause of a liter of water in the engine compartment over two days of rain? I would agree this looks like a mess but screw holes weren't quite as bad as I was expecting. Open to advice here and wondering what other leak sources I should be checking....

Yes.

mikeiso1192 · « **Reply #19 on:** May 10 2017, 14:39 »

Echo!

MPDausen · « **Reply #20 on:** May 11 2017, 19:59 »

I've had rain water on my stbd aft cabin mattress from directly below pedestal; intend on just opening up instrument panel and re-sealing.

Salty · « **Reply #21 on:** May 11 2017, 23:03 »

Quote from: MPDausen on May 11 2017, 19:59

I've had rain water on my stbd aft cabin mattress from directly below pedestal; intend on just opening up instrument panel and re-sealing.

See reply 16 above, and check for water tracking forward along cables from the area under that PVC panel and dripping off a low point in the area below the pedestal. I think this is more likely than a leak from the instrument panel.
An easy check is to spread some dry paper towels inside the lazarette under the pvc panel and any wires or cables that lead forward from that area to a point under the pedestal, then give the cockpit a good wash down with a few buckets of water before considering any attack on the instrument panel.
Any leaks will show up on the paper towels.

Sam Ward · « **Reply #22 on:** May 29 2017, 16:13 »

Thanks for all the great help on this topic. I put newspaper under all suspected rain water sources and discovered that primary source was from under the cup fitting holding post for the radar dome on rear backstay. I saw this issue during survey last Fall but it somehow slipped my mind. The photos below show repair which has addressed 90% of my problem. I can see a few other deck stanchions and things that I will need to re-bed next year but almost no water at present and ready to move on to installation of high water bilge alarm. 3M 5200 product is great stuff. Thanks again for help with this issue.