Author Topic: Fuel tank debris - inline fuel filter size?  (Read 9197 times)

solar

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Fuel tank debris - inline fuel filter size?
« on: October 11 2015, 19:13 »
Hi,
Can someone help me find the right size filter?
6-8-10mm? what will fit to my fuel hoses?
Thanks

Nigel

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Re: Fuel tank debris - inline fuel filter size?
« Reply #1 on: October 11 2015, 23:12 »
It would be useful to know what boat, a Bavaria 38 Cruiser?

My Bavaria 47 has 10mm fuel hoses, with a 2 litre engine.
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solar

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Re: Fuel tank debris - inline fuel filter size?
« Reply #2 on: October 12 2015, 07:54 »
Yes, 2008 38" Cruiser with D1-30B engine.
Do you think that mine are the same hoses like in your 47'?

Craig

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Re: Fuel tank debris - inline fuel filter size?
« Reply #3 on: October 12 2015, 23:43 »
Have a look at posts in Topic " Percentage of Fuel returned to Tank" in posts below. There is a photo of the strainer that you need.

I think that you would need a Strainer, not a Filter as such. I don't know the size of the fuel lines on each model of Bavaria but I know the strainer in the photo came off a Bavaria 52 and the same size fits my Bavaria 38.  The Strainer can be purchased at most large Auto-Supply shops. It is held on with jubilee clips.

I have found that most blockages in Bavarias are at the Fuel Cut-Off switch, not blocked Primary Filters or in the fuel line. This is why I have fitted the in-line strainer ( cost 3 or 4 euros) between the tank and the cut-off switch.

There are a number of posts regarding ways to inspect your tank and clean it out. I use a Pela Oil suction pump, the one I use for oil changes, to suck out anything on the bottom of my fuel tank. It is inserted through the opening for the fuel line from the tank.   

Craig
s/v "Shirley Valentine"

solar

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Re: Fuel tank debris - inline fuel filter size?
« Reply #4 on: October 13 2015, 10:05 »
Thanks Craig,
I saw the picture.
What is the fuel hose size on your 38"?
I can't order one before I'm sure about the size I need.
What is the difference between an inline strainer and a filter?

Craig

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Re: Fuel tank debris - inline fuel filter size?
« Reply #5 on: October 13 2015, 12:03 »
Gidday Solar,

Sorry, I don't know the fuel line size on "Shirley Valentine" and as she is currently on board a ship on the way to OZ at the moment, I can't check.  Currently between Panama and Pago Pago in American Samoa. I won't see her until about the 10 Nov.

The "Strainer" I use, as shown in the photo, has a metal mesh to catch large blobs of gunk. It merely ensures that lumps can't clog the fuel cut off switch. The Primary filter has a paper element that removes the fines.  I can't remember the specifications of the filter. 

The plastic strainer has graduated sizes on the ends to accommodate a range of internal diameter fuel lines.  I can confirm that the strainer was easily fitted to my Bavaria 38 and the same strainer can be, just as easily, fitted to a Bavaria 52. I am 90% sure it will fit any size fuel line on any Bavaria.

I am told that most of the large Auto Spares suppliers in Europe sell these as fuel strainers.  At 3 to 4 euros each, it is probably easier to look in your local supplier. I don't think you would need to buy these strainers over the net.

Craig
s/v "Shirley Valentine"   

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Nigel

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Re: Fuel tank debris - inline fuel filter size?
« Reply #7 on: October 15 2015, 06:36 »
The "Strainer" I use, as shown in the photo, has a metal mesh to catch large blobs of gunk. It merely ensures that lumps can't clog the fuel cut off switch.
It seems to me that the solution to this problem is not trying to prevent the ridiculously small bore of the cut-off from being blocked, but replacing it.

http://www.asap-supplies.com/search/ball+valve/brass-ball-valve-female-each-end-405202
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solar

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Re: Fuel tank debris - inline fuel filter size?
« Reply #8 on: October 15 2015, 08:40 »
Thanks guys,
Good advises.
Anyone have the inner assembly plan of the Bav original fuel cut-off valve and fuel hose size?
I need that info to buy what I'll need for the modification.
I'm far away from my own boat.
If anyone already done it some pic' will help.


Craig

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Re: Fuel tank debris - inline fuel filter size?
« Reply #9 on: October 16 2015, 07:57 »
Solar,

The plastic in-line fuel strainer that I have installed on my Bavaria 38 is the same size installed on many Bavarias, and other yachts, of different sizes and engine capacities. The Plastic in-line strainer I installed is exactly the same size as the one I photographed as it came off a Bavaria 50 ( or 52)).

I tend to disagree with Nigel's suggestion, as shown, for 2 reasons. Firstly, it took me less than 5 minutes to install the clear plastic in-line strainer. The strainer I sourced and the jubilee clips are easily obtainable from most large discount Auto Parts suppliers.  I've been told that they are common in Europe and I have seen them in Super Cheap Auto in Australia. I would have difficulty in installing a control valve like the one in the photograph as I would also have to source attachments for the flexible fuel line and adapt the attachment to the bottom of the bunk where the current switch is located. Secondly, the in-line clear plastic strainer has the advantage of allowing you to easily see any build up of gunk. Increasing the size of the cut-off switch merely moves the problem to the top of the primary filter where you would not know there was a problem until the engine cuts out.

My suggestion does have one big problem and that is the fire risk, as the plastic strainer cover does not have the fire rating that fuel line has. I have accepted this on the basis that the risk of fire and the consequences are much lower overall than the risk to the boat of having the engine cut out in rough seas entering a harbour.

I installed the in-line strainer by cutting the fuel line between the tank and the cut-off switch, pushing the ends of the strainer into the fuel line and, for security, securing with jubilee clips.

I don't believe that installing another Filter is the way to go. You have 2 filters already in the system, the primary filter and the secondary fuel filter on the engine next to the fuel pump.

I'm having trouble posting additional photos but will try later.

Craig
s/v "Shirley Valentine"

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Re: Fuel tank debris - inline fuel filter size?
« Reply #10 on: October 16 2015, 08:50 »
Here is the info I accumulated when I replaced all my fuel pipe components. The first paragraph may help the OP determine the bore...

Marine Parts Express show the MD22P-B fuel pump nipple as part number 834781.
Searching for this found the following reference: "Connection to 3/8" fuel hose ... [requires nipple] 834781"
So 10mm (3/8") BS7840 hose. £20 for 5m.


I used "ear clips" on most of the joints, except the two on the engine where for ease of removal I used "Mini Clamps" (NOT Jubilee Clips).

Tank: 8mm compression to 10mm hose nozzle x2 >>> BES 8992
Filter: 1/4"-18 NPTF male to 10mm (3/8") hose nozzle x2 >>> ASAP HOSE TAIL RACOR 1/4"NPT TO 3/8" HOSE 301953
Pump and return: 1/2" UNF male to 10mm hose nozzle x2 >>> eBay item number:271285361416

Tap: BALL VALVE 3/8 BSP FEMALE TEE HANDLE ASAP Part No. 405202
Tap: 3/8 BSP M/F elbow x2 eBay 111196757689
Tap: 3/8 BSP M hose nozzle x2 eBay 111269900680
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Re: Fuel tank debris - inline fuel filter size?
« Reply #11 on: October 16 2015, 09:06 »
Can you please elaborate on " ear clips & mini clips".  I only know of jubilee clips?

Nigel

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Re: Fuel tank debris - inline fuel filter size?
« Reply #12 on: October 16 2015, 09:26 »
Can you please elaborate on " ear clips & mini clips".  I only know of jubilee clips?
Jubilee Clips are not good with small diameters of 25mm or less, so...

Mini Hose Clamps



Ear Clips



Note: links found at random, check diameter and prices etc...
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solar

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Re: Fuel tank debris - inline fuel filter size?
« Reply #13 on: October 16 2015, 16:23 »
I agree with Craig.
Adding an inline fuel strainer will prevent the need to replace the BAV OEM fuel valve.
It worked fine for 7 years on my boat and the strainer will keep debris away and catch them before they clog the valve.
Why fixing something that works?
I'll be at my boat in 2 weeks and will see with own eyes what to buy and how to make this modification.
Thank you all.

Salty

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Re: Fuel tank debris - inline fuel filter size?
« Reply #14 on: October 16 2015, 23:18 »
Browsing online looking for a fuel strainer, I came across this device from Agreimach which is supposed to polish the fuel and thereby prevent the fuel bug from multiplying and giving us aggravation. I appreciate it won't necessarily remove debris as such, but if it does what they claim by polishing the fuel it would over time prevent any large gobs of fuel bug from developing and any consequent blocking of the fuel line. Usually the fuel pump drags more fuel from the tank than is actually needed by the engine, with the excess being returned to the tank via a spill line, so over a period of time the entire content of the tank would pass through the device and get polished !!

http://www.agriemach.com/c68-fuel-filtration/c184-debug-diesel-bug-killers/p1227-debug-uk-l140

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Re: Fuel tank debris - inline fuel filter size?
« Reply #15 on: October 17 2015, 06:29 »
I installed a device which probably does the same - Algea-x.
Not sure I would have purchased it if it was not on a bid in Ebay and I got it at a very low price, but I can say that I have never had a problem of any clogging in the fuel system. However since I did it shortly after purchasing the boat there is no way to know if I would have problems had I not installed this device.
S/Y Lyra
B36 / 2004

Craig

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Re: Fuel tank debris - inline fuel filter size?
« Reply #16 on: October 18 2015, 21:55 »
Nigel is correct in regard to using a clamp rather than Jubilee clips when clipping small diameters. I used jubilee clips because they were available, I will be replacing them as soon as I get a chance.

The jury seems to be out in regard to using magnets to stop Diesel Bug. The magnets may only temporarily stop the growth of the bug.  "Yachting Monthly" has published a number of articles over the years and results of testing Biocides and Enzymes to control Diesel Bug.

I had Startron ( an enzyme) in my tank the last time I had an attack of Bug. The engine had little use over the previous 4 months. I installed the In-Line Strainer after the attack and got a big blob of gunk in the strainer within 1 hour of using the engine. However, after a 9 hour trip under motor, the Startron had broken down the gunk. I checked the primary filter and also found it to be clean. I think the Startron only works when the diesel is heated by the return flow and does not appear to work in cold diesel over winter in European climates.
. I also understand that Volvo have discontinued their use of magnets in the systems they supply.

My view is that Biocides, Enzymes and possibly magnets may only partially work. We also need a way of capturing the gunk, seeing what is forming and having a quick easy system to rectify the problem at sea. I have spare filters, a spare strainer, a dinghy pump with a nozzle that I can use to blow fuel lines clean and an enzyme. I can "fix" any blockage within minutes if I get a problem. 

The following article refers to some of the tests on magnets. I should state that magnets were tried on swimming pool systems with limited success. UV light and electric current systems have also been used in swimming pool systems. The electric current devices work but are not practicable for boats.   

 November 29th, 2012

Are magnets a reliable way to treat fuel problems?

We have many fuel polishing systems keeping diesel in prime condition for back up power applications in many data centres, hospitals and other critical applications.  But we are often asked ?why don?t you fit fuel magnets??

There is actually very little hard, trustworthy data to support the claims that magnets effectively treat any form of diesel contamination.  Some were originally introduced claiming that they ?killed diesel bug? others were developed with the aim of altering the molecular structure of fuel.  There is plenty of opinion and anecdotal evidence but we have yet to see a study that proves any lasting, positive effect.

What we do know, is that a study by the Australian Department of Defence found that a particular brand of fuel magnet had no discernible effect on diesel bug and other contaminants, and actually introduced more contamination into the fuel as the magnets eroded, causing an increased risk of filter blockage.

Other studies have suggested that, while magnets can slightly disrupt the growth of microbes, this is only a temporary state and once clear of the magnet field they revert to normal growth and multiplication ? none are killed.  The same is true of the formation of wax crystals ?  when subjected to a magnetic field there is some softening of the crystals but once free of the magnetic effect for 14 seconds the effect is gone.

More worryingly, from our own experience we also know that, where fuel deliveries have high quantities of iron ? which can be common  ? magnets can actually induce filter and fuel system blockage by causing iron particles to agglomerate together.  Certainly not what you want in a critical back up power application.

We recommend ? Efficient fuel polishing, using world class filtration, to remove particles and water.  Keep the water out and you keep the bug out.  If you do get diesel bug, clean the tank or use a biocide ? and keep polishing!

If you would like to know more about IPU Fuel Conditioning Solutions, call us on 0121 511 0400 or email ipu@ipu.co.uk

Craig

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Re: Fuel tank debris - inline fuel filter size?
« Reply #17 on: October 18 2015, 22:01 »
Sorry, had a typo in last post.

I can "Fix" any blockage within minutes while at sea.

[Note from Nigel: corrected for you, but the Modify function on the top right of any post should be available to you at all times]