Author Topic: Engine overheating (on port tack) - 2007 B33  (Read 9484 times)

Sparrow

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Engine overheating (on port tack) - 2007 B33
« on: August 29 2014, 00:15 »
During the passage home from the solent last weekend on my 2007 B33, the engine overheating alarm went off. Once when we were running the engine to recharge the batteries at the end of the night, and again while motor-sailing up Foulger's Gat. We went carefully through all the checks before we got home, and every bit of the system appeared to be working fine, and we had no trouble motoring into the marina, so it all appeared a bit of a mystery...

However searching through the web the next day I find that we had suffered a 'known problem' with the Volvo D1-20 engine.  It's obvious when pointed out, as shown in the attached picture; if the boat is leaning to starboard then the engine header tank is well below the heat exchanger - up to 4" below with a decent angle of lean. This means all the air in the system can move up the bleed pipe to the heat exchanger, and the resulting airlock stops it working.

So far so simple -  but the question is: what should I do about it?
  • Do I just accept that I can't motor-sail on port tack? After all it's taken me many years to realise it's a problem.
  • Or do I fix things by increasing the height of the header tank? If so where is the best place to mount it? To the wall of the engine compartment, or on an extended bracket above the existing mounting?
Has anyone else seen this problem? And if you have, did you fix it and if so how? Any advice welcome.

And on  a related note, has anyone upgraded the 'not very alarming' engine alarm?  I could hardly hear it above the noise of the engine on tickover...

IslandAlchemy

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Re: Engine overheating (on port tack) - 2007 B33
« Reply #1 on: August 29 2014, 08:10 »
Different engine, but my expansion tank is screwed to the back wall of the engine bay, well above the engine. I would suggest that this has to be worth doing, as it's not tricky or expensive to do.

andersson

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Re: Engine overheating (on port tack) - 2007 B33
« Reply #2 on: September 04 2014, 09:56 »
Hei.
I think it will be a good idea to check the exhaust, the place water comes out. Too feed the engine with water you need too make sure the water can leave also.

Trapeze Artist

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Re: Engine overheating (on port tack) - 2007 B33
« Reply #3 on: September 04 2014, 10:26 »
That's a very interesting hypothesis. I have a D1-20 in my Bav 30. I have had the overheat alarm go off on (I think) four occasions. Three of those were in generally rough conditions when we were pitching and rolling a lot. The last occasion was while hoisting sails in windy conditions and we may have had a fair degree of heel to starboard.

I'll look into this when I'm next on the boat. My first thought is to move the header tank to mount it on the port-side wall of the engine bay. I think there's room there, and there will be less horizontal distance from the heat exchanger.

CRYSTAL

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Re: Engine overheating (on port tack) - 2007 B33
« Reply #4 on: September 09 2014, 15:36 »
Hi check out my thread below on 'Exhaust Elbow' and my overheating probs.

U nead to open up the front of ur HE and clean out any debris or even removing it to properly clean the 'noodles ' basically the heat exchanger. Make sure u buy the o-rings. Also worth while to inspect the exhaust elbow for any build up of rust.

Good luck
Hratch
CRYSTAL I

CRYSTAL

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Re: Engine overheating (on port tack) - 2007 B33
« Reply #5 on: September 11 2014, 16:50 »
On your other note about the very faint alarm, you'll need to buy an extra harness from VP dealer EUR 130 or so that connects yo the exciting evc harnes. Loud buzzer as well.

Check this site and need items 1 and 2 

http://www.volvopentashop.com/Volspec/en-GB/Details/PentaPartsCatalog/7746500_130?path=MarineDieselEngines%2F7746500%2F7746500_30%2F7746500_130

The other two connections are for neutral and secure start switch if u need the connections otherwise leave them as they are shorted.

Now I can hear the buzzer at 2500rpm on my D1 30.

BR
Hratch
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Salty

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Re: Engine overheating (on port tack) - 2007 B33
« Reply #6 on: October 04 2014, 20:02 »
Two points really, the first is that I've added some sound insulation to the top of the engine compartment on my B36, and the reduction in engine noise in the cockpit area was astonishing. As a result, when my boat engine overheat alarm went off last week for the first time since I bought it five years ago, it was very easy to hear.
The second point of course was why did the engine get hot enough for the alarm to sound ? After limping back to my mooring, I started to examine and take apart the various parts of the cooling system, and to cut a long story short, I took off the rubber end caps from the md2020 heat exchanger. This was the first time ever that these caps had been removed as the paint on them remained original and untouched. Once the forward cap was off, three pieces of impeller vanes were found along with a piece of shell barnacle about 10mm in length and breadth plus some smaller parts of presumably the same barnacle shell. In all there was sufficient debris to cover about 70% of the ends of the tubes within the tube nest. Hopefully I've found the problem that caused the overheat, but it's worth while mentioning that every single impeller that I've changed, and that is one each year, in all instances the impellers were in very good order with no missing parts. That means that these impeller vanes were lost during the period of the boat's previous ownership. The moral of course is that I should have checked it out sooner. Prior to the overheat there had been some warning signs which was that the flow of water did not seem to be as much as I'd have anticipated. And there was some vapour evident which I was undecided (at the time), whether it was smoke or steam.
So the moral is to take the end cap off and check there is nothing loose that might block the tubes for the heat exchanger, particularly if like me, the boat was bought secondhand. I'll let you know if the overheat problem has been solved after I've put everything back together next week.

Salty

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Re: Engine overheating (on port tack) - 2007 B33
« Reply #7 on: October 15 2014, 16:52 »
I put it all back together last week, but still there was a problem with water flow. So I took the hose off the valve on the saildrive and noticed here that the flow of water into the bilge was slow. Poking a thin nylon rod down through the valve I felt a small resistance which then cleared and water began to flood into the bilge at a more reassuring rate, so shut the valve and reconnected the hoses, but on running the engine, while there was a good water flow at first, it slowed down as soon as I opened the throttle indicating the blockage is something loose which remains within the saildrive leg. I've just bought a 2m long flexi brush designed for cleaning the inside of pipes which I will try out next time onboard, and hopefully that will clear whatever is within the water intake within the leg. Also I will pour water down the inlet hose so that hopefully anything loosened will get flushed out. If that doesn't work I'll try connecting a pump to back wash through the leg as next lift out is not due until the spring.

Spirit of Mary

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Re: Engine overheating (on port tack) - 2007 B33
« Reply #8 on: October 15 2014, 17:31 »
Many Bavaria's have the expansion tank mounted higher at the back wall. This is a modification recommended by VP at least when a water heater is added.
Bavaria's  standard is mounting at the engine, but this in practice gives many cooling problems. For Bavaria this is much cheaper in the fabrication process, because doing this it is an integrated part with the Volvo engine.  I think the Volvo engines are fitted by Volvo personnel.
This expansion tank location has also been a topic on the Dutch Bavaria (BZc with > 1000 members) Forum.
Salty, in your case this maybe will not solve your problem, but maybe other cooling problems in future.
Ger

Salty

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Re: Engine overheating (on port tack) - 2007 B33
« Reply #9 on: October 18 2014, 23:54 »
Well, some crud came out using the brush, but I couldn't get the end of the brush past the first bend despit putting an initial bend in the end of the brush, or rotating it in the hope that it might just find the right way. Even though I couldn't get the brush to go down the pipe, the water flow into the bilge increased again, and after putting the system back together and running the engine has resulted in the most flow of water I've ever seen from the exhaust overboard outlet.
I'll just have to watch it carefully until the boat comes ashore, then I'll clean the tubes inside the saildrive leg from below before finishing up with a jet of water being squirted down from inside.
As for that expansion tank, I've got one which is located near the top of the aft engine room bulkhead.

Spirit of Mary

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Re: Engine overheating (on port tack) - 2007 B33
« Reply #10 on: October 19 2014, 09:39 »
Sorry Salty, I saw the picture of Sparrow the TS. This has mounted the expansion tank on the engine, which is not optimal and gives many problems. I mixed you up with Sparrow.
Reg,
Ger

battuta

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Re: Engine overheating (on port tack) - 2007 B33
« Reply #11 on: July 26 2017, 14:08 »
Well this old thread has been really helpful to me, as I recently had a motorsailing overheat problem in big seas (second in two months) on my D1-20 that I now realize was an airlock arising from the expansion tank location issue....

So Sparrow and Trapeze Artist (or anyone else), did you end up remounting your expansion tank higher, and if so where? Can you post a photo? I think I'll make doing this a winter project.

Thx in advance for any additional perspective or advice anyone can provide here.

Riyad
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Vancouver, Canada

saltash182

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Re: Engine overheating (on port tack) - 2007 B33
« Reply #12 on: July 27 2017, 11:12 »
Also very helpful, this happened to us last weekend when we motor sailed home from Salcombe. Thanks for posting.

Impavidus

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Re: Engine overheating (on port tack) - 2007 B33
« Reply #13 on: July 29 2017, 14:31 »
Sparrow. You need to do this mod seen in the picture. The same problem happens on the D1-30 and others.
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Ricd

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Re: Engine overheating (on port tack) - 2007 B33
« Reply #14 on: July 30 2017, 12:41 »
Have not got a pic but when we installed our new D1-30 the header tank interfered with engine compartment step/hatch when closed so we removed the rear lifting eye (can see it back right on your pic) and used the threaded hole / bolt to reposition the header tank on top of engine above heat exchanger...so far so good.

Krill

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Re: Engine overheating (on port tack) - 2007 B33
« Reply #15 on: July 22 2019, 22:24 »
It would appear we are having something similar to this occurring in our d1-20

Here’s a photo of the cooling setup, am I best raising it?


Salty

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Re: Engine overheating (on port tack) - 2007 B33
« Reply #16 on: July 23 2019, 05:17 »
It would appear we are having something similar to this occurring in our d1-20

Here’s a photo of the cooling setup, am I best raising it?

On my B36/2002 I have the MD2020 engine, the header tank is mounted high up on the aft bulkhead port side, referring to your picture it is mounted on the rightt above the black piece of electrical equipment shown there.

I’ll get a photo next time onboard and post it here.

Also as Sparrow and Battuta have mentioned above, there is a maximum recommended angle of lean when motorsailing, see highlighted area in photo below taken from my engine manual.

Krill

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Re: Engine overheating (on port tack) - 2007 B33
« Reply #17 on: July 23 2019, 08:39 »
It would appear we are having something similar to this occurring in our d1-20

Here’s a photo of the cooling setup, am I best raising it?


Also as Sparrow and Batista have mentioned above, there is a maximum recommended angle of lean when motorsailing, see highlighted area in photo below taken from my engine manual.

thanks for that, i was only heeling 10-15 degrees so thought it could be an installation issue, could also just have been coincidence and have been a plastic bag over my saildrive but im trying to cover all bases and see if i do have an issue and came across this thread

water flow looks fine (although defining flow rate is difficult) the exhaust water is warmer than what goes in, the coolant looks ok, although it does drop slightly when running but still above min.

engine was running ok for an hour ish, i also cant really work out how long it takes to warm up a boat engine under load, 10-15mins?

i've checked the thermostat and that operates, a little mud in the strainer but i wouldnt have thought that was significant to cause poor flow??

just want to make sure i cover most things before setting off on a longer trip :) worse case i can stick a hose into the sea from the header tank i guess if it does crop up again, but its annoying me because i cant find anything wrong!

Salty

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Re: Engine overheating (on port tack) - 2007 B33
« Reply #18 on: July 23 2019, 16:53 »
.
.
just want to make sure i cover most things before setting off on a longer trip :) worse case i can stick a hose into the sea from the header tank i guess if it does crop up again, but its annoying me because i cant find anything wrong!

No, don’t do that. The header tank is for the fresh water system within your engine. If you introduce sea water to the fresh water system all kinds of corrosion within the fresh water side of the engine will start to occur. Just top it up from one of your fresh water tanks with a couple of drinking mugs full of fresh water.

If you are having problems with raw (sea) water cooling take a look at my earlier comments in this thread, namely replies 6 and 7.

Krill

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Re: Engine overheating (on port tack) - 2007 B33
« Reply #19 on: July 23 2019, 18:13 »
I meant raw water strainer intake as yes that would be silly,